Temperature Celcius

Temperature Celcius - Сообщения

#1 Опубликовано: 27.02.2019 21:30:59
Basile

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Hello,
Why this discrepancy?
Capture-smath-1.PNG

Thank you,
Basile
#2 Опубликовано: 27.02.2019 21:47:25
Jean Giraud

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Wrote

Why this discrepancy?


Maybe user style ?

Basile.PNG

#3 Опубликовано: 28.02.2019 05:37:32
Martin Kraska

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°C can't be cancelled against K. Changes or differences of temperatures have to be tagged by Delta in the non-absolute temperature units.

See this post
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frapuano 28.02.2019 06:05:00, Davide Carpi 28.02.2019 06:31:00, Andrey Ivashov 28.02.2019 16:01:00
#4 Опубликовано: 28.02.2019 16:12:30
Andrey Ivashov

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Wrote

°C can't be cancelled against K.


Wolfram alpha says K/°C=1.
Do we need the same behavior?
#5 Опубликовано: 28.02.2019 16:50:01
Arie

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Wrote


Wolfram alpha says K/°C=1.
Do we need the same behavior?



It doesn't show that here: https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=1kelvin%2F1degC

It converts °C to Kelvin before performing the division.

Edit: Here shows the result 1 K/K, but it specifies it's interpreting °C as delta degree C.

Personally, I prefer using the explicit Δ°C when performing these types of computations. I understand it's may be more confusing to some, but I also believe it's important to be explicit in syntax.
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Andrey Ivashov 28.02.2019 18:29:00
#6 Опубликовано: 28.02.2019 17:07:15
Alvaro Diaz Falconi

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Wrote

Wrote

°C can't be cancelled against K.


Wolfram alpha says K/°C=1.
Do we need the same behavior?



Hi Andrey. Wolfram says what the author of the units package thinks that it's correct. Actually, here it's my own Mathematica units package: http://library.wolfram.com/infocenter/MathSource/5511/

I think that it's better check what says the SI norm:

https://en.smath.com/forum/yaf_postsm51217_Temperature-Units-Discrepancy.aspx#post51217

Best regards.
Alvaro.
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Andrey Ivashov 28.02.2019 18:29:00
#7 Опубликовано: 28.02.2019 18:30:26
Andrey Ivashov

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Wrote

It doesn't show that here: https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=1kelvin%2F1degC

It converts °C to Kelvin before performing the division.



I've tried this one: https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=1*K%2FCelsius
#8 Опубликовано: 28.02.2019 18:50:07
Arie

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Wrote



I've tried this one: https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=1*K%2FCelsius



Interesting. I would think these both should compute to the same value since WA says they are assuming temperature in degrees Celsius and not delta temperature.

For what it's worth, I think the image on the right is incorrect IF assuming degrees Celsius as stated.

Untitled.png

The following explicitly states the assuming of degrees difference and computes to 1 appropriately.
Untitled2.png
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#9 Опубликовано: 01.03.2019 04:38:18
Martin Kraska

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Did you attach the wrong image? I don't see an appropriate computation to 1. Instead, I see 1*K/K, K is not cancelled, perhaps because each stands for different quantities. Yet I don't see why any tagging or assumption making should be required for offset-free temperature units. Is there any example where such distinguishing would be required?

Wrote


The following explicitly states the assuming of degrees difference and computes to 1 appropriately.
Untitled2.png



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#10 Опубликовано: 01.03.2019 05:55:04
Davide Carpi

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:d





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#11 Опубликовано: 01.03.2019 10:23:04
Martin Kraska

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All the elaborate assumption making doesn't save WA from adding two absolute temperatures and taking the result as a difference.
I still vote in favour of the Delta-tagging of non-absolute units. Perhaps we should add a hint on that to the help strings of °C and °F (to use Deltas if changes or rates are expected).
As long as temperature results strictly default to K units, we are safe. If someone wants to write °C, he will see the hint and still can judge whether to tag or not to tag with Delta. This might reduce the frequency of this issue popping up in the forum.
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frapuano 01.03.2019 10:54:00, Arie 01.03.2019 11:19:00, bdrunagle 01.03.2019 13:25:00
#12 Опубликовано: 01.03.2019 15:12:46
Jean Giraud

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SI units system is largely not compatible with Engineering.

degC.PNG
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